and family, but was never satisfied with evasive answers. Once day, his father gave him a copy of the spiritist magazine “Reformador”, the greatest treasure he has received, according to him. Thereafter Sebastião de Lima has dedicated the majority of his life to the Spiritist Doctrine.

Although retired due to a visual disability and been able to study until the elementary school, Sebastiao is a Spiritist speaker that makes about 360 speeches a year in Brazil. He follows his Spiritual friends inspiration to develop his doctrinary work. He has three children and has recently launched the book Existe algo Além, published by Mythos, which talks about the losses of pride, the delusions of jealousy and the blessings of immortality.

In a recent meeting he has given us the following interview:

O Consolador: How did you get to know the Spiritist Doctrine and when?

I had the first contact with the Spiritist Doctrine when I was between 9 and 10 years old, and several factors contributed for this to happen. I used to live in a farm, with no TV and it was a family tradition to sit together and chat. The favorit topic was ghosts and hauntings, and I used to asked my father why people die and come back to haunt other people. He gave me several publications to read which never satisfied my questions until he gave me the “Reformador” magazine, where I found the answers and learned that we do not die, we survive death. I had contact with folk healers that cured people and also freed crops from pests; I used to see people that nobody else could; therefore I had contact with Spiritism since my childhood.

O Consolador: How did you become a spiritist speaker? When did you start giving lectures?

I cannot tell how it started, just know that the facts led me to this. When I was 17 I have attended to a wedding and people asked me to make a speech to the bride and groom. After the speech I received many hugs and compliments. And that's how it started. Whenever there was a wedding, baptism or funerals, they asked me to make a speech. I have been doing this for over 60 years, but I started to give lectures in the Spiritist Centres as from 1964.

O Consolador: During the lecture, how do you feel the Spirit’s influence?

I naturally feel the spirit’s influence. I am sure that when I describe the facts, the words come spontaneously; as if someone was anticipating the outcome of what was being taught and what I should say, since I have a very simple vocabulary. For example: 2 years after my son Saulo passed away, I was delivering a lecture about the dettachment law and I knew that at a certain stage there would be a word difficult for me to pronounce. When the world “usufructuary” came to my mind, I tried to pronouce it four times with no success, then I saw my son Saulo and his friends. Saulo was laughing when he nudged the arm of one of his friends and said: - My father cannot pronounce usufructuary - and everybody laughed as well. Things come to my mind in a natural way. I hear a gentle voice deep inside telling me the words, I completely trust my spiritual friends and always bear in mind that I did my best.

O Consolador: How does it feel when you have the situation where you can make a poem out of a word given by the public?

Many say I am improvising, but nothing is mine, because the spirits know how to do things. I feel it, and I trust them completely. Sometimes I do not know what I'm talking about but the Spiritis know, therefore we always get it right in the end.

O Consolador: How did your public react when you launched the book?

This is not my concern because any work on behalf of the Spiritist Doctrine, anything good that happens is for the Spiritist Doctrine and not for me. Cumpliments are not for me, but for the Doctrine; I am what I am because of the Spiritist Doctrine. I owe everything I am to the Spiritist Doctrine and good things always happen because of the Doctrine.

O Consolador: How do you feel the public vibration during the lectures?

Wonderfully. I feel the vibration in a spectacular way. Again, it is not for me, because I do not speak about anything that I have but the Gospel of Jesus, because people are in need of a word. If you add your own things to the speech and one day you are feeling sad or low, you will pass this to the public. When you talk about the Gospel you may have your soul in pain, as I had mine during my son’s funeral, but I did not pass my pain because I was talking about the Gospel. I understand people because I am always amongst them, I speak their language, I take their best and I also give them my best.

O Consolador: Which aspect of the Spiritist Doctrine you like the most?

The world without spiritism is a world without sun, the world without the spirits would be in complete darkness. The world will be a bad place until it takes the decision to spiritualize itself. Every time people choose a religion, whatever it is, and put their the heart to it, they enlight the world, as Jesus once said: "You are the light of the world." "You are the salt of the earth," and so we will experience the Doctrine of the Spirits, as there is no religion withouth the soul, because the body does not need religion, but the soul, which is immortal. The body is just a tool, such as a school uniform, but the spirit will continue forever, with the need of developing itself. The body came from dust and to dust it will return. One of the most important aspects of Spiritism is reincarnation, because without it there wouldn’t be divine justice.

O Consolador: How do you see the difficulties faced by the human beings?

At the moment I see the world like the Babel tower. Everyone wants to go to heaven, but do not know how. I understand that, as it is written on the Brazilian flag "Order and Progress", for the world to progress there must be order and organization, Jesus id in command and we shall obey. In a large scale we have the planets, then the continents and nations such as Brazil. In Brazil there are families and within a family, each of us. I must not wait for laws and decrees to know what is right or wrong. To be good, to have discipline, order, respect, I have to do to others what I learned. If it's good for me, is good for others. When the humanity thinks like that, the world will be wonderful.

O Consolador: In your oppinion, what is the biggest challenge of the human race?

It is to expel the evil and ignorance because when someone is ignorant, it becomes also proud, arrogant, jealous and selfish. All these diseases bring chaos to society. The greatest dangers are not the wars, epidemics or hunger, but the fatigue of the good people, of those who do not use what they already know, because the good always wins. Be honest, decent, respectful, polite, this is what will bring the world together.

O Consolador: According to your experience, what can be learned from the variety of institutions and activities inspired by the Spiritism?

I learned that if I lock the little knowledge I have in a box, I will only have that amount. If you have some seeds and do not plant them, you will not reap. I think it is important to take the little I know to different places, it is like I am planting seeds, which will be reaped by others.

O Consolador: Is there anything else you would like to say?

I hope, even though it may take centuries, that I continue to have the possibility of contributing, even if a little, to develop the environment around me. As I said I do not believe in death. I'll soon be 66 years old and I know that I can return to the Spirit’s world at anytime, but I will always continue this project because it reminds me of someone that came and spoke about great things, but was misunderstood and crucified. I do not desire that a person remains in the dark after hearing the Gospel through me or any other people. My only wish is humanity to be happy, this will make me happy since I am part of it, the Spiritist Doctrine taught me that. I do not believe that God created the world for people to be unhappy, and I do not believe that He has placed me in this world to complain about it, the main reason to be alive is to sow the good.
I wish the world to be in peace. For me the material gains depend heavily on the spiritual values, as you may have many material possessions but not value yourself, which will for sure lead you to bankrupcy.